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Who's to blame?

#1 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 09:50


Scoring: IMP


West North East South

 1♥    3♦    3♥    4♠
 Pass  Pass  Dbl   Pass
 Pass  Pass  
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#2 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 10:02

There is no reason to believe that 4H is a maker or that there is a spade fit or that 4S makes even with a fit.

South gets all the blame - and shot at sunrise.
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#3 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 15:47

Mostly south. The south hand has adequate defense and reason to suspect that 4♥ won't make so 4♠ is an overbid and got justly punished
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#4 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 16:29

North has a normal preempt. ♥Axxx in their suit isn't enough of a reason to pass.

4♠ is wacky. Lots of defense against 4♥, a broken suit, and a partner who probably doesn't have too many spades.

South gets the charge here and I can't think of any reason why South doesn't get all the blame.
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#5 User is offline   nigel_k 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 16:33

South 100%. I'd play 3♠ as forcing there but 4♠ is too much either way.

I wouldn't crucify South though as the previous commenters have suggested. The preempt makes people guess and this time it made partner guess. 4♠ could make but it's just not the percentage course of action.
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#6 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 16:42

crucifixion works for me.
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#7 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 17:02

North certainly didn't do anything wrong.
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#8 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 17:41

helene_t, on Aug 1 2009, 06:02 PM, said:

North certainly didn't do anything wrong.

Well that is debatable as they did sit down at the table :D
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#9 User is offline   Hanoi5 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 19:06

Mostly South. North shouldn't have preempted with 4♥'s and such an ugly diamond suit, but this is no reason to believe North has 2 or more spades (North might as well be 0364). South could also have saved some by bidding 5♦.

View Postwyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:

Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the ♥3.


View Postrbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:

Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win


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#10 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2009-August-01, 19:43

As Phil already stated, North has a normal pre empt. 4H is no reason not to pre empt. South gets 100% of the blame. Whu should their be a S fit on this hand, and even if there is, why should 4S make?
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#11 User is offline   EricK 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 01:09

4♠ is very unilateral. South is right to the extent that because of the ♦ fit, there could easily be a game in ♠ on. The trouble is, he doesn't yet know if there is a ♠ fit or not! A 3♠ bid is surely enough.
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#12 User is offline   peachy 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 02:24

All South. 4S is unlikely to make and South cannot know if 4H (if they even bid it) is making. I would go further, he has reason to believe it is not making. After the adventure into 4S, South could have converted to 5D because when the opponents doubled 4S, it is certain we are doomed in 4S.
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#13 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 05:43

4♠ put the pressure at the wrong moment, this bid might work sometimes, but here it didn't.
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#14 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 05:49

South 100% for reasons already stated by many: 4♠ is ridiculous
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#15 User is offline   shyams 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 06:47

I'm expressing an opinion here. Please feel free to correct me...

I think most of you are unduly harsh on South. I'd blame South as well, but nowhere like 100%

The result may have been engineered by East who raised to 3H with a 3-card support. Most people raise with 4; and South expects partner with ?36? (good diamond suit) or ?37? (any diamond suit). And in both cases, if partner produces 2-card support in spades or even a singleton Q, 4S could jam opponents.
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#16 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 07:15

Phew, Im North here but did feel like rescuing partner after 4♠X

Sitting south would anyone support ♦'s after the opps 3♥'s?


Scoring: IMP


West North East South

1♥ 3♦ 3♥ ?
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#17 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 07:18

No. It is usually a good idea to assume partner has Hx when you preempt. Well this sentence did not make much sense, so I'll say it like this: if partner preempted and you have Hx, assume partner knows about it (and start supporting only with Hxx or so).
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#18 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 07:42

gwnn, on Aug 2 2009, 06:18 AM, said:

No. It is usually a good idea to assume partner has Hx when you preempt. Well this sentence did not make much sense, so I'll say it like this: if partner preempted and you have Hx, assume partner knows about it (and start supporting only with Hxx or so).

3 of partners suit would be nice but this hand does have 2 Aces, Kx and shape
and 9 card fit.
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#19 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 07:47

You're too weak for game if partner has few spades and you'd like to play spades if partner has many spades. So I don't think choosing diamonds is a good idea.
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#20 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2009-August-02, 08:07

IMO the options are Pass and 3♠. While I think 4♥ is probably going down at IMPs I pass as a form of insurance against it making. At MP I definitely bid 3♠
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