[barmar]

blackshoe, on 2015-September-11, 15:42, said:

It affects their ability to earn a living by playing bridge. While people have a right to earn a living, I'm not so sure they have a right to do so by whatever means they choose. My response to a bridge pro who got caught cheating and who then complained "you've taken away my right to earn a living!" would be "no we haven't, we just aren't going to let you do it in our tournaments or clubs. Go find some other game to cheat in."

It's not just their tournaments. Their reputation is tarnished, which prevents them from getting hired to play in any tournament.

It's similar to what happens if a teacher is falsely accused of molesting a student. It may be impossible for them to get a teaching job, and I imagine they could sue the accuser for defamation.

[blackshoe]

Yeah, I understand that, Barry. But if the criteria for banning a player for cheating, or even just bringing up the possibility, are that stringent, it will almost never be the case that anybody will be formally charged with anything resembling cheating. Seems to me that's pretty much what we have now, and an awful lot of people are saying they don't like it. "Cheating is rampant," they say, "and we need to put a stop to it." Can't have it both ways. Pick one or the other.

[bridgeqb]

rhm, on 2015-September-11, 01:42, said:

Your descriptions is correct, your conclusions are faulty.
Due process is in deed designed to protect the innocent ones. That's why it is important.

But it does not follow, that due process protects the guilty ones as well.

Rainer Herrmann

It's the claim of the dolts that wrote the handbook not mine. But I can't refute it - excluding some evidence because of protection of rights would be at least as helpful to the guilty as the innocent and the
numbers are now skewed to guilty getting off.

[barmar]

blackshoe, on 2015-September-11, 19:03, said:

Yeah, I understand that, Barry. But if the criteria for banning a player for cheating, or even just bringing up the possibility, are that stringent, it will almost never be the case that anybody will be formally charged with anything resembling cheating. Seems to me that's pretty much what we have now, and an awful lot of people are saying they don't like it. "Cheating is rampant," they say, "and we need to put a stop to it." Can't have it both ways. Pick one or the other.

I'm not saying we shouldn't put a stop to cheaters. But that doesn't mean that bridge leagues should be immune to lawsuits.

[blackshoe]

No, it doesn't.

[Aberlour10]

I think many members are not able to follow all these monster threads at the BW. Would someone here give a description about recent developements and current standing in this issue?. Thanks.

[blackshoe]

Briefly, Boye Broglund says there's more to come, the IBF is investigating, The EBL is investigating, the ACBL is investigating, Fisher and Schwartz have said they aren't going to play together for now, the Israeli team has withdrawn from the Bermuda Bowl, and Jimmy Cayne has said that he's down with giving up the Spingold title, and will not have anything to do with these two in future if the results of the investigation (he was referring here, I think, to either the IBF or the ACBL one, but I suppose it wouldn't matter which one) showed that Fisher and Schwartz were cheating. The rest, IMO, is the clucking of chickens in the barnyard.

[WGF_Flame]

Trinidad, on 2015-September-05, 10:44, said:

I don't agree. F-S have already said hey won't play together until this is resolved. The Bermuda Bowl starts at the end of this month. The sooner the EBF vacates the qualification spot, the easier it is to replace the Israeli team in the BB.

And no matter what would happen in the next few weeks, it would be very hard (if not impossible) for the Israeli team to perform well under these circumstances.

Rik

FS were not on the Israeli team for this year bermuda.

[Trinidad]

WGF_Flame, on 2015-September-12, 23:18, said:

FS were not on the Israeli team for this year bermuda.

But FS were on the team that earned the qualification.

Rik

[Fluffy]

I expected more from Brogeland already, is it being delayed or something?

[lamford]

Fluffy, on 2015-September-13, 06:17, said:

I expected more from Brogeland already, is it being delayed or something?

I have heard rumours that another dramatic announcement is imminent ...

[shyams]

Fluffy, on 2015-September-13, 06:17, said:

I expected more from Brogeland already, is it being delayed or something?

My conjecture on Boye's role in the F-S unveiling is that he probably initiated all the dramatic announcements without a full road map for his "royal flush".

• I base this conjecture on the fact that most of the groundwork was done by other people after the inital "♠J" announcement.
  
• A few days later, Boye's new videos focused on coughs and their supposed significance rather than on signals using the placement of the boards.

I wouldn't be surprised if no new material is presented.

[Fluffy]

You mean... another pair(s)?, that is consistent with the names Brogeland has picked for his webpage (bridgecheaters) and facebook page (Bridge: a clean game)

[mgoetze]

lamford, on 2015-September-13, 06:46, said:

I have heard rumours that another dramatic announcement is imminent ...

I've got my popcorn ready, but the NFL starts in 2½ hours so this announcement had better be quick.

[Fluffy]

shyams, on 2015-September-13, 08:29, said:

My conjecture on Boye's role in the F-S unveiling is that he probably initiated all the dramatic announcements without a full road map for his "royal flush".

• I base this conjecture on the fact that most of the groundwork was done by other people after the inital "♠J" announcement.
• A few days later, Boye's new videos focused on coughs and their supposed significance rather than on signals using the placement of the boards.

I wouldn't be surprised if no new material is presented.

That though passed through my mind as well, but I don't think this is an issue were boye would bluff

[cherdano]

shyams, on 2015-September-13, 08:29, said:

My conjecture on Boye's role in the F-S unveiling is that he probably initiated all the dramatic announcements without a full road map for his "royal flush".

• I base this conjecture on the fact that most of the groundwork was done by other people after the inital "♠J" announcement.
  
• A few days later, Boye's new videos focused on coughs and their supposed significance rather than on signals using the placement of the boards.

I wouldn't be surprised if no new material is presented.

Well, it's been established that coughing indicates a weak hand (in the context of the auction). And it seems pretty clear Boye was aware of that. I also find it hard to believe that he posted the 3NT-lead video, was convinced there was a signal for the heart lead, and didn't think to look at the unusual board placement.

But if I was a cheater and he showed me the ♥J, I knew I'd fold - even if it's a semi-bluff, I'll likely be found out once lots of eye-balls are watching videos of sets I played.

[aguahombre]

shyams, on 2015-September-13, 08:29, said:

My conjecture on Boye's role in the F-S unveiling is that he probably initiated all the dramatic announcements without a full road map for his "royal flush".
[list]
[*]I base this conjecture on the fact that most of the groundwork was done by other people after the inital "♠J" announcement.

And where did you get the "fact" that most of the groundwork was not already in progress by those people before the first announcement?

[johnu]

lamford, on 2015-September-13, 06:46, said:

I have heard rumours that another dramatic announcement is imminent ...

I don't know if it means anything, but Franck Multon of the Monaco team posted an article on BridgeWinners basically attacking Boye. I can't think of any reason for doing so unless ..... ?

[MrAce]

johnu, on 2015-September-13, 12:43, said:

I don't know if it means anything, but Franck Multon of the Monaco team posted an article on BridgeWinners basically attacking Boye. I can't think of any reason for doing so unless ..... ?

Then I think I know the 2nd bombshell pair name. I did not read it yet, I will go check now.

[lamford]

MrAce, on 2015-September-13, 13:10, said:

Then I think I know the 2nd bombshell pair name. I did not read it yet, I will go check now.

The post was so astonishingly badly written that I was tempted to suggest that he wrote it in his native language and I used Google Translate, but I was hauled over the coals when I once did that on here! The post:

Mr Boye Brogeland is a funny Man When he play with Fischer -Schwartz , he dont speak for cheating but When the next year he loose against this pair

He réveal all , i am not sûre is clean attitude . Poor. Fischer Schwartz if he continue to play with this Man is better

I think one response is enough:
"I don't understand the post. Sorry" - David Gold