[Vampyr]

barmar, on 2014-January-28, 10:45, said:

That should only be necessary if declarer has a serious speech impediment.

Is there a point at which a foreign accent qualifies as a "serious speech impediment"?

[aguahombre]

Vampyr, on 2014-January-28, 09:51, said:

What would you suggest?

Seven Flash cards with the four suits plus K, Q, &J. Then if you are missing a finger, make a card with "10" on it.

[aguahombre]

Vampyr, on 2014-January-28, 10:59, said:

Is there a point at which a foreign accent qualifies as a "serious speech impediment"?

Yes, when an American visits England.

[ggwhiz]

mycroft, on 2014-January-28, 10:55, said:

I played in Montreal.

For my first Regional in Montreal they used French cards with dozens of accidents between the Valets Dames and Roi's and a bunch of irate out of towners.

Before bidding boxes too. They fixed the cards the next year and as soon as my pard and I started to bid in (very poor) French our opps insisted on English.

[Vampyr]

barmar, on 2014-January-27, 19:23, said:

The problem wasn't the word for Jack, it was the word for "small", which happens to sound like "jack". Even if you would have said "knave" if you meant the Jack, your partner might still hear "jack".

Another word for "small", then as well; I know that some languages permit "young".

[RunemPard]

They are not exactly alike, but when I say them maybe they do sound more alike than they should. The Swedish word for small is liten and the word for jack is knekten. I have never had an issue with anybody mixing them up in the past when I said them, so I do not know. I would not be surprised if the opponents on the table actually heard me right and chose to ignore my partner taking the wrong card or were simply not paying attention. After all, they thought once they played a card it was too late. As for my partner, maybe in his mind I was already playing the jack. Mix that in with my not so great Swedish and he could easily hear me saying jack. When I wanted to have this corrected, the opponents simply said too late, the trick is over. At which point I explained that I was playing for one distribution of the cards and if it sits this way it makes. The first director was called at which point he said he had not played the board before really hearing the issue. (Walked in on me continuing my discussion to opps) Another silver tournament qualified director came and said it cannot be undone. I was so upset that I honestly never even thought about asking to see the law book. So after this the result was -2 doubled.

But as I said earlier...I am truly not surprised if they both heard me call for a small properly and never mentioned it. I even thought that about this during the ruling...

As for using the word "small", which I know many here absolutely hate. I see no problems with it. It is accepted here in any club as being the lowest possible and if you use it you absolutely must take the smallest.

[blackshoe]

Vampyr, on 2014-January-28, 10:40, said:

Well, it didn't happen that often, and anyway I find it annoying when an opponent plays dummy's cards unless dummy has gone to the bar, so I wouldn't want to do this.

i'm not suggesting that an opponent play dummy's cards, I'm suggesting that declarer do so. I think the situation I described is sufficient to invoke the second sentence of Law 45B.

[blahonga]

RunemPard, on 2014-January-28, 15:55, said:

They are not exactly alike, but when I say them maybe they do sound more alike than they should. The Swedish word for small is liten and the word for jack is knekten.

Have you tried consistently asking for knekt (jack) instead of knekten (the jack)? This might help since the two words don't have the same number of syllables.

[Vampyr]

blackshoe, on 2014-January-28, 16:19, said:

i'm not suggesting that an opponent play dummy's cards, I'm suggesting that declarer do so. I think the situation I described is sufficient to invoke the second sentence of Law 45B.

What do you mean, the defenders playing dummy's cards? What a bizarre idea. Why would they do that, and how does it help with a language issue?

[Vampyr]

RunemPard, on 2014-January-28, 15:55, said:

But as I said earlier...I am truly not surprised if they both heard me call for a small properly and never mentioned it. I even thought that about this during the ruling...

I wouldn't worry about this. Better to hope that next time you get a director who knows what he is doing, and if you are in doubt have him read out the Law.

[blackshoe]

Vampyr, on 2014-January-28, 18:44, said:

What do you mean, the defenders playing dummy's cards? What a bizarre idea. Why would they do that, and how does it help with a language issue?

I misunderstood you. Apparently, you meant you don't like it when an opponent, as declarer, plays dummy's cards. I don't know why you would object to this; it's a perfectly legal procedure, so long as there's a good reason for it. Dummy not understanding what cards you've instructed him to play is a good reason.

[Vampyr]

blackshoe, on 2014-January-28, 20:09, said:

I misunderstood you. Apparently, you meant you don't like it when an opponent, as declarer, plays dummy's cards. I don't know why you would object to this; it's a perfectly legal procedure, so long as there's a good reason for it. Dummy not understanding what cards you've instructed him to play is a good reason.

I don't like it when there is no good reason, because it blocks my view of my partner's card and anyway I find it intrusive.

I also don't like playing the cards myself every hand. I had a partner who went for a fag every single time he was dummy, and it made the game much less enjoyable for me.

Obviously it is different at rubber bridge, where you play the cards into the middle and don't have to keep the hands intact.

[Bbradley62]

Couldn't you just omit the word for "small" and call the suit, knowing that dummy is to play the lowest card in the suit when the rank is not specified?

[FrancesHinden]

It's not quite as simple as saying that the TD was definitely wrong, tell him to read from the Lawbook next time.
The TD has to decide which of these two possibilities is correct:

You originally meant to call for a small card, but you had a slip of the brain and in fact you did call for the Jack
You called for a small card, mis-heard by dummy as the Jack

In the latter case, you can change it (as various people have said)
In the former case, you can't.

If 3 people at the table said they heard you call for the Jack, then the TD is likely to rule that is what happened, even though you 'know' that you didn't.

[RunemPard]

The other two players never said I called for the jack...they said I cannot have it changed.

[RunemPard]

Bbradley62, on 2014-January-28, 22:50, said:

Couldn't you just omit the word for "small" and call the suit, knowing that dummy is to play the lowest card in the suit when the rank is not specified?

I do this often, but at the time I just called for small. I will be trying to say a (suit name) more often though.

[barmar]

Last night at the club, there was a moment when declarer called for "heart ace", but the rest of us thought it sounded kind of like "club ace". The only ace in dummy was in hearts, nor was there a club 8, hearts were trump and declarer was obviously in the midst of drawing trumps. I think dummy gave him a quizzical look and confirmed that he meant heart, then we all just laughed it off as a weird occurrence. "heart" and "club" don't really have any sounds in common -- I think he just said it kind of quietly, with poor enunciation, so it could have been almost anything.

[Bbradley62]

barmar, on 2014-January-29, 16:23, said:

"heart" and "club" don't really have any sounds in common

but "trump ace" and "club ace" do.

[pran]

barmar, on 2014-January-29, 16:23, said:

Last night at the club, there was a moment when declarer called for "heart ace", but the rest of us thought it sounded kind of like "club ace". The only ace in dummy was in hearts, nor was there a club 8, hearts were trump and declarer was obviously in the midst of drawing trumps. I think dummy gave him a quizzical look and confirmed that he meant heart, then we all just laughed it off as a weird occurrence. "heart" and "club" don't really have any sounds in common -- I think he just said it kind of quietly, with poor enunciation, so it could have been almost anything.

Bbradley62, on 2014-January-29, 18:41, said:

but "trump ace" and "club ace" do.

I trust that barmar would not have used the word "heart" in his post if declarer had used the word "trump" ?

[barmar]

Now that I think about it some more, I think his pronunciation of "heart" was kind of like "huh" (we're in the Boston area, so pronouncing trailing R's is illegal). Since H is not a strong sound, what we mostly heard was the vowel -- "uh ace".