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LA or not?

#21 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2013-April-16, 19:55

View Postnige1, on 2013-April-16, 19:19, said:

The hesitater eventually signed off in 4.
IMO: on the given facts, the decision is close. The OP implies that South could check on key-cards with an immediate 4N. Instead, he made a 4 slam-try. South may well have intended to go on, whatever North bid. That's uncertain but North's hesitant sign-off made slam an even better bet. So maybe the committee decision was reasonable.

First, 4S is not a "sign-off". It merely shows the lack of a cuebid, which he was asked to make. If he had hesitated and then failed to bid 4D with the King instead of the QJ, we would have a different opinion of the hesitation.

Second, there was no 4D slam try.

Third, I found it interesting that the A/C ruled as it did while the BBO contributors would have ruled to the contrary, and conclude something else was involved. I agree with the BBO people on this one, but was questioning whether I might be prejudiced by East's inaction.

Maybe there is something which prejudiced the A/C the other way.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#22 User is offline   Cascade 

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Posted 2013-April-17, 00:52

View Postwank, on 2013-April-15, 04:48, said:

hesitation


7 went for 1400 against 6 making. east-west called the fuzz at the end of the board to complain about south bidding on after his partner's hesitant sign off. it's pretty obvious the hesitation suggests bidding on, so is pass an LA?

South would claim his hand guarantees slam opposite the right number of keycards.

east-west would claim that south bidding on with keycard is obviously dirty, as he didn't make another try, and that he could have keycarded over 3S [knowing the pair in question, i would go 100-1 about a direct 4NT being anything other than keycard]. Cueing implies a culsultative role for partner, who he subsequently overruled.

FWIW I wasn't involved. Slam makes on the diamond finesse. Partner's hand is Aktxx x Qjxxx Qx.

Edit: The committee ruled it back to 4S. As this was in the Balkans all sorts of hyperbole ensued.


Slam is favourite to make opposite many seven counts. Partner has shown more than that and rates to have the seven points we need. Pass can not be a logical alternative here.

We play 3 is not forcing here and I would bid on opposite a non-forcing 3.

Additionally, it is unclear to me that a slow pass suggests bidding on. There is no description of 4 and it is far from clear to me that it necessarily clearly agrees spades. If for example it was a general force or choice of games type situation then a slow 4 would just suggest the decision was close compared with some alternative denomination.
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#23 User is offline   WesleyC 

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Posted 2013-April-17, 04:49

For me, passing 4S isn't a logical alternative.

I also disagree with OPs assertion that "it's pretty obvious the hesitation suggests bidding on".

North might have a really bad hand with second round control of a red suit and be wondering about whether showing it here is mandatory.
Or maybe they're wondering whether 4C sets Spades or if it could still be first round control of clubs in a strong heart hand and trying to find their weakest continuation.
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#24 User is offline   jdeegan 

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Posted 2013-April-19, 04:12

:P Hesitation or not, the bidding makes perfect sense to me. 6 might go down, but South can count a decent play for 12 tricks with one possible loser opposite any number of minimum hands:
AKxxxx
xx
Qxx
Qxx
After RKC, bidding six seems clear.

Good hand for serious 3NT.
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#25 User is offline   jallerton 

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Posted 2013-April-19, 11:15

View Postjdeegan, on 2013-April-19, 04:12, said:

Good hand for serious 3NT.


Really? The sequence 1-(3)-3-(P)-3NT is a serious suggestion to play in 3NT.
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#26 User is offline   mfa1010 

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Posted 2013-April-30, 15:31

No, imo is pass not a LA. We have a perfekt hand to blackwood, I wouldn't expect many players not to do so.
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#27 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2013-April-30, 16:05

View Postmfa1010, on 2013-April-30, 15:31, said:

No, imo is pass not a LA. We have a perfekt hand to blackwood, I wouldn't expect many players not to do so.


But pass is not the only alternative to 4NT, am I the only one who think other bids are possible?
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#28 User is offline   mfa1010 

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Posted 2013-May-01, 01:30

View PostFluffy, on 2013-April-30, 16:05, said:

But pass is not the only alternative to 4NT, am I the only one who think other bids are possible?

I don't see why we should choose anything else but 4N.
Here we want to play slam opposite 2 key Cards and stay in 5 opposite 1 key Card.

Anyway, partner's hesitation doesn't suggest that 4N is better than some other slam move, so the discussion of which move to make/is a LA is not important.
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#29 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2013-May-03, 08:49

View Postmfa1010, on 2013-May-01, 01:30, said:

I don't see why we should choose anything else but 4N.
Here we want to play slam opposite 2 key Cards and stay in 5 opposite 1 key Card.

Anyway, partner's hesitation doesn't suggest that 4N is better than some other slam move, so the discussion of which move to make/is a LA is not important.
Because the hesitation suggests that partner has a good hand, so as long as he has 2 keycards, slam will make. While cuebidding would allow him to evaluate his hand and sing off even with 2 keycards when a diamond lead beats us.

I just say that blackwood is suggested over other slam moves IMO.



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