[jdonn]

---

North deals, how would you bid at imps?

Second, if the auction goes like this ATB for not being in 3NT, or if you think it was all reasonable, or whatever.
1♣ 2♦
2♠ 2NT
3♣ 4♠
4NT 5♣

1♣: 16+ artificial
2♦: Natural, 12+
2♠, 2NT, 3♣: Natural
4♠: Splinter for clubs
4NT: Last train - not keycard
5♣: Should pass 4NT haha jk

[JLOGIC]

Much easier hand in standard, you can just bid:

1S 1N
2C 2N
3N

I think 4S is a very poor bid though, you have a complete minimum in HCP, no aces, and terrible clubs.

Your options are bidding 3N or 3H. 3H almost always shows a club fit, and partner will bid accordingly. With 6 diamonds we bid 3D. With 2 spades we try 3S (possibly 3N with no spade honor and chunky red suits). There are some 1453 hands that would bid 3H I guess, but that hand type has 3N and 4N available. It would have to be something like x Axxx AKxxx KJx that plays really well for clubs I think.

To me bidding 3N is really reasonable, our hand is so AWFUL for a 4-4 fit that we don't even want to risk getting to one at the 5 level. We also do not want to encourage partner when we have almost all of our (stone minimal values) in the red suits, and not headed by an ace...and a void in his suit!

Imagine hands like

AQJxx
xx
Ax
AQxx

Which have the requisite keycards etc. This hand is in big trouble even at the 5 level. I would never want to get to 6.

But 3N is kind of a masterminding bid with 4 card support in clubs. If partner has 5-5 in the blacks our hand increases a lot in value, and he might pass it with that.

3H also allows partner to punt it back with 3S so we can stop in 3N which is nice. I'd *still* be worried that my hand is so awful that we might get to 5C/6C instead of 3N when it's wrong.

Bidding 4S is just completely lol bad though. It shows a complete lack of understanding of hand evaluation to me. Even bidding 4C is really bad. How can we go past 3N?

[JLOGIC]

Also if anyone thinks north should not bid 3C I think that is totally wrong. Yes it's a bad 4 card suit in a slam auction, but partner often has 4 clubs and we are primed out with the AQ of his first suit. We have a fine hand for clubs, and it gives room to partner to bid 3D and we can find a 6-2 fit still.

Lastly, we could belong in 4S in the 5-2. We do have NO heart stopper, and that could be a problem. 3C leaves everything open.

[Free]

I think the auction up to 3♣ is fine. Agree with JLo that 3♣ is the best possible rebid.

4♠ is awful imo. There's only a small chance opener will have a poor ♠ suit.

[gnasher]

In the strong club auction, is the second-round 2NT normal with responder's hand? I'd expect a more balanced hand than that.

I'm not suggesting that 3♣ by responder would help us to get to 3NT - clearly it wouldn't.

[Cyberyeti]

At IMPS I don't have a huge problem with this auction, if the N hand is AJxxx, xx, AQ, AQxx we probably need this sort of auction to reach 6♣. which appears to need little more than a 3-2 trump break (or Axxxx, xx, AQ, AQJx which may not even need that).

We would bid:

1♠-2♦
2N-3♣
3♥-3N

2♦ 9+ with 5 or 10+ with 4
2N GF, not necessarily balanced
3♥ 4th suit

[JLOGIC]

gnasher, on Jul 13 2010, 03:49 AM, said:

In the strong club auction, is the second-round 2NT normal with responder's hand? I'd expect a more balanced hand than that.

I'm not suggesting that 3♣ by responder would help us to get to 3NT - clearly it wouldn't.

If you have to bid 3C with 0454, how do you find a 4-4 heart fit? I don't think bidding 3H as natural with 5-4 in the majors by opener is that viable, it makes life too tough.

In general I view these auctions as similar to 1S-2D-2S where 2S is a catchall. In that case bidding 2N is not necessary in order to facilitate finding hearts, but if you have good hearts I don't think partner will ever expect it after a 3C bid, and he might raise you past 3N when it's wrong. I like 3C to be a stronger statement about playing clubs, either no heart stopper or 5-5 or maybe 6-4 (depending on shape).

I remember one hand where I had a tough time because I didn't know whether partner had a spade or not and had to guess between 3N or 4S, but I think generally it doesn't cost you that much to play 2N as 0+ instead of 1+ spade.

With that in mind, jdonn always used to make fun of me and my partner (who he used to play with) for bidding 2N on these auctions more than any sane person.

[gnasher]

JLOGIC, on Jul 13 2010, 01:04 PM, said:

If you have to bid 3C with 0454, how do you find a 4-4 heart fit? I don't think bidding 3H as natural with 5-4 in the majors by opener is that viable, it makes life too tough.

Yes, I agree that allowing 0454 shapes into 2NT is a good idea when you're 0454 and partner has four hearts. I was thinking more about all the other deals.

[gszeszycki]

Dealer: ?????
Vul: ????
Scoring: Unknown
♠ AQJxx
♥ xx
♦ AQ
♣ Axxx

♠
♥ KQ9x
♦ KJ9xx
♣ Kxxx



North deals, how would you bid at imps?
2/1 this seems somewhat straightforward depending on partnership agreement

if your partnership plays standard
1s normal
2d normal
3c (shows extra values)
3n (even if opener has clubs responder has minimum power and 9 of 12 in the reds.
PASS opener has shown the extra values responder seems not to care and opener
is pretty much minimum in the extra value department. Would not fault a 4D bid
as long as responder can bid 4n as a sign off.

If partnership plays 3c does not promise extra values (my preference at imps)
1s normal
2d normal
2s catchall
2n nothing much else to do
3c showing extra values and clubs
3n who cares
PASS I showed my extras and have nothing else to add. Would not fault a 4d bid
as long as responder can bid 4n as a sign off.