[Califdude]

Assuming you are playing 2NT Jacoby Forcing, how do you interpret the 3D bid in this sequence? Is opener asking about a help suit, or showing shortness?

1♠-P-2NT-P
3♦

Thanks for your replies.

[mtvesuvius]

Shortness in regular Jacoby.

I would however like to recommend a modification of Jacoby...

1M - 2NT is Defined as Jacoby, but the responses are different:
-- 3♣ - Any Minimum
----- 3♦ - Shortness Ask
-------- 3♥ - ♣ Shortness (Regardless of M)
-------- 3♠ - ♦ Shortness (Regardless of M)
-------- 3NT - Other Major Shortness
-------- 4m - Cuebid; No Shortness, Maximum-Minimum
-------- 4M - No Shortness, Garbage hand
-- 3♦ - Extra Values; No Shortness
-- 3♥ - ♣ Singleton
-- 3♠ - ♦ Singleton
-- 3NT - Other Major Singleton
-- 4♣ - Void in ♣
-- 4♦ - Void in ♦
-- 4M - Void in Other Major

After these defined bids you are in a GF, you just cuebid... 3NT can be Baby RKC or Serious, your choice.

AJK

[Winstonm]

Quote

I would however like to recommend a modification of Jacoby...

Me, too. Don't play it.

[rogerclee]

mtvesuvius, on Dec 25 2008, 03:23 PM, said:

1M - 2NT is Defined as Jacoby, but the responses are different:
-- 3♣ - Any Minimum
----- 3♦ - Shortness Ask
-------- 3♥ - ♣ Shortness (Regardless of M)
-------- 3♠ - ♦ Shortness (Regardless of M)
-------- 3NT - Other Major Shortness
-------- 4m - Cuebid; No Shortness, Maximum-Minimum
-------- 4M - No Shortness, Garbage hand
-- 3♦ - Extra Values; No Shortness
-- 3♥ - ♣ Singleton
-- 3♠ - ♦ Singleton
-- 3NT - Other Major Singleton
-- 4♣ - Void in ♣
-- 4♦ - Void in ♦
-- 4M - Void in Other Major

I would suggest that after 3♣-3♦, play 3♥ is any shortness (with 3♠ asks) to free up room for more common hands (like 6322 and 5332).

I would also suggest that you keep 4-level bids to show a good 5-card side suit with extras.

To answer the original question, yes, it is diamond shortness. There is nothing really wrong with the SAYC Jacoby 2N structure, but it can clearly be improved upon. That said, if you are an intermediate player, I don't think it's worth the memory strain (at all).

[Fluffy]

3♦ shows shortness in standard Jacoby.

[Rossoneri]

As the others said, 3♦ shows shortness.

As the others said, this is not the best.

[P_Marlowe]

Rossoneri, on Dec 25 2008, 11:28 PM, said:

As the others said, 3♦ shows shortness.

As the others said, this is not the best.

But works reasonable, and hence is best, if you
play only a limited amount of boards.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[OleBerg]

mtvesuvius, on Dec 26 2008, 12:23 AM, said:

Shortness in regular Jacoby.

I would however like to recommend a modification of Jacoby...

1M - 2NT is Defined as Jacoby, but the responses are different:
-- 3♣ - Any Minimum
----- 3♦ - Shortness Ask
-------- 3♥ - ♣ Shortness (Regardless of M)
-------- 3♠ - ♦ Shortness (Regardless of M)
-------- 3NT - Other Major Shortness
-------- 4m - Cuebid; No Shortness, Maximum-Minimum
-------- 4M - No Shortness, Garbage hand
-- 3♦ - Extra Values; No Shortness
-- 3♥ - ♣ Singleton
-- 3♠ - ♦ Singleton
-- 3NT - Other Major Singleton
-- 4♣ - Void in ♣
-- 4♦ - Void in ♦
-- 4M - Void in Other Major

After these defined bids you are in a GF, you just cuebid... 3NT can be Baby RKC or Serious, your choice.

AJK

I've had some experince with this, and you need to make an addition.

If you play:

1M - 2NT
3♦ = Extra values, no shortness.

you need to be carefull with the continuations. The sequence

1M - 2NT
3♦ - 4M

is a nightmare if opener holds a hand just below a 2♣ opening. Thus 4M should be much more well-defined than simply: No slam interest.

[H_KARLUK]

Opener :KJ832 A65 10 A954
Responder : A10764 KQ5 872 K7

O     R
1♠ 2NT
3♦ 4NT
5♥ 6♠
After responder uses the Jacoby 2NT, opener bids 3♦ to show his singleton. This is encouraging news for responder because it means his club and heart honors will fit well in partner's hand. Knowing that his xxx suit is covered by opener's singleton -- and that opener's outside strength is in clubs and/or hearts -- responder can use Blackwood to check on aces, and then bid his 24-point slam.

Note that responder would evaluate his hand very differently if opener's answer to the Jacoby 2NT had been 3C or 3H. Singletons in these suits wouldn't be helpful because responder's kings may well be "wasted" cards opposite the singleton. Over opener's 3C rebid, responder would just jump to 4S to show that he no longer had interest in slam.

[andy_h]

yeap, 3c/d/oM is showing shortness in standard jacoby.

[mtvesuvius]

OleBerg, on Dec 26 2008, 08:19 AM, said:

I've had some experince with this, and you need to make an addition.

If you play:

1M - 2NT
3♦ = Extra values, no shortness.

you need to be carefull with the continuations. The sequence

1M - 2NT
3♦ - 4M

is a nightmare if opener holds a hand just below a 2♣ opening. Thus 4M should be much more well-defined than simply: No slam interest.

Yes, I agree. 4M would be bid on a 12 HCP 4333 or something of the like. 4m are cuebids, and 3M is minor slam interest (Anything that is a Minimum, but not absolutely rock bottom.) This can of course be expanded upon, so please feel free to add and suggest recommendations/modifications etc...



AJK

[peachy]

Califdude, on Dec 25 2008, 05:09 PM, said:

Assuming you are playing 2NT Jacoby Forcing, how do you interpret the 3D bid in this sequence? Is opener asking about a help suit, or showing shortness?

1♠-P-2NT-P
3♦

Thanks for your replies.

There is nothing to interpret. Opener shows singleton or void in diamonds. If 3D does not show that, then opener is not playing Jacoby 2NT.

There are other systems which many say are better than Jacoby 2NT but if Jacoby 2NT is agreed, then one should not go modifying it in the middle of an auction

[paulhar]

While 3D shows shortness in "standard" Jacoby, there is some disagreement what 4D shows in standard Jacoby - I have heard both "a void" and "a broken 5-card suit". You might want to know which one your partner plays.