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Scoring: IMP
You're playing with a good partner, 2/1 with no special agreements. Opponents are passing and the auction so far is:
1♠ - 1NT (forcing)
3♠
Now what?
How aggressive are you?
#1
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Posted 2008-July-08, 11:31
You're playing with a good partner, 2/1 with no special agreements. Opponents are passing and the auction so far is:
1♠ - 1NT (forcing)
3♠
Now what?
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
#2
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Posted 2008-July-08, 11:33
El Paso, Texas
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#3
- World International Master without a clue
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Posted 2008-July-08, 11:36
What matt said.
#4
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Posted 2008-July-08, 11:53
3NT with no real confidence. Pass is ok with me.
#5
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Posted 2008-July-08, 11:54
Self sufficient suit, I think 4 spades has a reasonable chance
#6
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Posted 2008-July-08, 11:54
Effit 3N. Probably should be called Idiot 3N, but I'm an idiot at times.
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#7
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Posted 2008-July-08, 12:15
3n is an awful bid. If we are bidding game, and I think we must red at imps, this is a clear 4♠.
I would far rather hold 2 spades to bid 3N, preferably Qx or so, so that I can count 6 winners in the suit. As it is, most of the time his suit will not generate 6 winners in 3N: he'll have to lose a trick, and there will probably be at least one suit in which we have only 1 stopper...
We often opt for 3N, reciting the mantra that 9 tricks are easier than 10, but these auctions tell us that 5 losers are more likely than 3.
I would far rather hold 2 spades to bid 3N, preferably Qx or so, so that I can count 6 winners in the suit. As it is, most of the time his suit will not generate 6 winners in 3N: he'll have to lose a trick, and there will probably be at least one suit in which we have only 1 stopper...
We often opt for 3N, reciting the mantra that 9 tricks are easier than 10, but these auctions tell us that 5 losers are more likely than 3.
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#8
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Posted 2008-July-08, 12:24
mikeh, on Jul 8 2008, 10:15 AM, said:
3n is an awful bid. If we are bidding game, and I think we must red at imps, this is a clear 4♠.
I agree with the first half of your argument. For me it's between pass and 4♠. Give me x xxxx Axxx Axxx and I think it's a crystal clear 4♠. Give me x Jxxx Axxx Kxxx and I find it right there on the cusp, but would bid 4♠ because it's vulnerable at imps. But an aceless hand without support is a pass to me. I think it's close, but I also think the risk on these types of hands is not just going off 1. This is the type of hand where we can get doubled on bad breaks.
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#9 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-July-08, 14:31
I would bid 4S playing with myself, 3N with a lot of beginners/intermediates, and pass with some aggressive 3S bidders. Naturally I think 4S is the right bid from a pure bridge stand point.
#10
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Posted 2008-July-08, 17:54
Agree that 3N is ugly unless all of my suits are full of 9 and 8's. I'm passing, but its easy to see how 4♠ could make.
"Phil" on BBO
#11
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Posted 2008-July-09, 00:50
IF 3 NT is ugly, what hand do you have for a 3 NT bid here?
To me3 NT describes a hand with at most one spade and values in all suits, so if I bid, this is exactly what I have and pd is not forced to pass if he thinks that his hand is better for 4 Spade.
I would always bid if 3 Spade is from a sane partner and I would always bid 3 NT if I don't have the agreement that this should show a very different hand.
To me3 NT describes a hand with at most one spade and values in all suits, so if I bid, this is exactly what I have and pd is not forced to pass if he thinks that his hand is better for 4 Spade.
I would always bid if 3 Spade is from a sane partner and I would always bid 3 NT if I don't have the agreement that this should show a very different hand.
Kind Regards
Roland
Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
Roland
Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
#12
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Posted 2008-July-09, 03:22
4♠
Kind regards,
Harald
Harald
#13
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Posted 2008-July-09, 03:34
Somewhere I picked up a tip - when opener/partner jumps in his opening suit - he has maximum one looser opposite a singleton. A new suit by responder should then be cue and one should bid 4M rather than 3NT....
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
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#14
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Posted 2008-July-09, 05:23
3Nt here. For me 3S in imps should be almost forcing. My hand has soft value and im happy to play the hand.
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For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
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For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#15
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Posted 2008-July-09, 09:31
firmit, on Jul 9 2008, 04:34 AM, said:
Somewhere I picked up a tip - when opener/partner jumps in his opening suit - he has maximum one looser opposite a singleton. A new suit by responder should then be cue and one should bid 4M rather than 3NT....
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
This tip is not very useful. After all, what should opener bid with a random 17 count and a so so 6 card spade suit? Barring the use of special conventions (Gazilli or a forcing 2NT or limited openings in a strong club system), you can't have it all.
I think the tip is actually very nice, if you change it slightly: "when opener/partner jumps in his opening suit and a non jump rebid would be forcing - he has maximum one looser opposite a singleton." In this case, 2♠ wouldn't have been forcing, so the tip can't be used.
Rik
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#16
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Posted 2008-July-09, 11:03
Nice kings, that says 4S for me.
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#17
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Posted 2008-July-09, 11:03
firmit, on Jul 9 2008, 02:34 AM, said:
Somewhere I picked up a tip - when opener/partner jumps in his opening suit - he has maximum one looser opposite a singleton. A new suit by responder should then be cue and one should bid 4M rather than 3NT....
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
This is true in a 2/1 sequence, not here.
#18
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Posted 2008-July-09, 11:13
I voted pass.
I can see more reason for 4♠ than 3NT.
I can see more reason for 4♠ than 3NT.
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Unless explicitly stated, none of my views here can be taken to represent SCBA or any other organizations.
Unless explicitly stated, none of my views here can be taken to represent SCBA or any other organizations.
#19
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Posted 2008-July-09, 11:15
firmit, on Jul 9 2008, 04:34 AM, said:
Somewhere I picked up a tip - when opener/partner jumps in his opening suit - he has maximum one looser opposite a singleton. A new suit by responder should then be cue and one should bid 4M rather than 3NT....
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
I believed him! Sure hope it has gotten some merits.... i'm bidding 4♠
I would put this tip back where you found it
AK108xx Axx AJx x: 1♠ 1N ? This is a 3♠ bid for just about everyone not playing gadgets, and this suit may but often won't play for 1 loser opposite a stiff.
AKxxxx AJx AJx x.. this is still a 3♠ bid in standard methods, and this is 64.5% at least a 2-loser suit opposite a stiff x.
BTW, it is the likelihood of having a spade loser (or 2) that makes 4♠ the better bid. At the risk of sounding condescending, and at the risk of having a player better than I post '3N, wtp', this is the type of hand that I think most experts bid 4♠ on and most non-experts bid 3N.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
#20 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-July-09, 11:54
mikeh, on Jul 9 2008, 12:15 PM, said:
At the risk of sounding condescending, and at the risk of having a player better than I post '3N, wtp', this is the type of hand that I think most experts bid 4♠ on and most non-experts bid 3N.
I really think this has a lot to do with non-experts playing with other non-experts who bid 3S with stuff like KQxxxx AKx Qx QJ routinely (or worse). Some of my partners do this very often because it is 16-18 and 6S so WTP, and with those people I think 3N is the right bid.