[msheald]

Hello! Poor Robot bid descriptions have been discussed before. I'll add some additional examples - 3 from a recent game of 12 hands.

https://tinyurl.com/2bohtrob

3 Clubs means 4+ clubs, 4+ hearts and 11+ total points. I suppose that some folks might get 11+ total points on distribution with this hand, but after partner bids NT, that becomes less likely. Additionally, one of my early lessons was that distributional points are counted most prominently in dummy - both of which are problematic for this hand. The most important point is that bids should never mislead partner, which is the case here.

https://tinyurl.com/2xjcves7

Double means 5+ spades and 6+ total points. A double as a bid description at the 4 level is problematic, in my opinion. I don't know of many folks who play it other than for penalty. Additionally, I'm not sure I know folks who count a singleton club as 6+ distributional points.

https://tinyurl.com/29mdhdx5

Definition states opener reverse - 5+ diamonds, 4+ spades, 2-hearts, 21- HCP, 18-22 total points. Sometimes, there is no "right" bid, but, as in this case, to me, it appears as a "wrong" bid and misleads partner.

I realize that bid programming is complex and can be expensive and introduce a number of problems. I support BBO's decision not to spend resources in fixing the robots, but I would think that bid descriptions would be easier, and less costly, to fix and significantly increase the enjoyment of robot games. Best regards.

Mike

[smerriman]

msheald, on 2025-June-28, 05:43, said:

I support BBO's decision not to spend resources in fixing the robots, but I would think that bid descriptions would be easier, and less costly, to fix and significantly increase the enjoyment of robot games.

You would think wrong. This is the hardest part of modifying GIB.

[pescetom]

msheald, on 2025-June-28, 05:43, said:

I support BBO's decision not to spend resources in fixing the robots

They are giving you the decades old and buggy "Advanced" robot free (rather than continually increasing the fee) or you just feel they deserve easy profit?

[johnu]

pescetom, on 2025-June-28, 14:54, said:

They are giving you the decades old and buggy "Advanced" robot free (rather than continually increasing the fee) or you just feel they deserve easy profit?

Actually BBO gives the deliberately crippled "Basic" robot for free, and charges for the decades old and buggy "Advanced" robot.

[benellis58]

Given that the GIB robots are a key part of BBO - probably THE key part - it is not at all impressive that BBO appears to be quite comfortable with having them be so consistently and utterly inept.

[mycroft]

Free play, with any 3 players anywhere in the world, any time of the day or night, for 20+years.

I'm a massive introvert, and that's *still* incredibly more important than playing with a C player that won't learn and won't change, but plays the cards well robot.

I think anybody who's nose is out of joint about "bad robot" (except for the people who say that playing with them hurts your real game, who have a point) has never been the designated spare/non-playing director for a club game. The number of worse-than-robots (because not only will they not learn (don't attempt to try, it'll only make it worse!) and won't change (they're having enough trouble remembering what they do play!), but they also play the cards slightly worse than Mrs. Guggenheim) I've played with, and will play with again, makes playing with robots a pleasant experience (at least they aren't telling you what (they think) *you* did wrong!) for whiling away 20-30 minutes on hold with the doctor, or a half hour on the bus, or that hour in the airport, or...

I mean, we should be *glad* that we're not in the chess world where even your laptop can beat all but the absolute top players. We especially should be glad that bridge is not a perfect-information game, and bidding and play methods are so variable, and so is somewhat resistant to T-800.

Should they be better? Sure. Should work be put into it? Yeah, probably. Should BBO do it over ensuring that my team game with my locals still goes, even if half the "locals" are in another country, and one is permanently in another city, 6 times a week? Or even ensuring that (paid) tournaments can be played, whether "for fun" or under the auspices/by one of 50 NBOs, with real players (some of whom the robots would trounce, 8 games out of 10)?

Well, if you're the kind of masochist who will pay to play events knowing how much they hate their partners, okay, sure. But if you're the person who will continue to reward them with your money, time, and energy even if they don't improve it? What's in it for them then?

Is robot important? Sure. Is it THE key part of BBO? Well, once all the 70+bridge players die and no 50+ new retirees come in, then sure, I guess...