Cyberyeti, on 2020-December-15, 09:39, said:
I dealt it in practice so it could have been either, I thought it was an interesting problem. Btw have you discussed how forcing 2♥-P-P-2♠-P-3♦ is ?
As an aside, I play very wide ranging weak 2s (although this one was perfectly normal) and we make most of our gains when people overcall 3♦ on hands like these. Either partner has the hand and doubles or they play 3♦ going off when 2♠/3♣ is the right spot.
In what universe can we reach 2S or 3C?
If we pass, and partner reopens with 2S, we’re hardly passing, so you’re not discussing that.
So you’re arguing for double.
That’s silly.
If we double, which is a monstrous overbid imo, you suggest passing 2S? If partner bids 2S, he has a weak hand, and you may notice that we have short spades. He’s not bidding 2S with as many as 6 unless he’s truly broke, which is possible but improbable. His normal strength rates to be around 6-10 hcp.
If we double and he uses reverse lebensohl, to get out in 3C, that would be pretty good, but just think of the likelihood that he does that.
You seem to suggest that it’s more likely that he has 6 clubs and a stiff diamond than that he has, say, 3=3 or 3=4 minors. That’s nonsense.
Plus, of course, double is not going to work well ifLHO raises hearts and partner introduces a 4 card spade suit at the 3 or 4 level.
Want to talk about missing games? You double, LHO bids 4H and partner has Jxxxx x QJx KQxx. He should and would bid 4S, almost surely losing a heart and 3 spade tricks, almost cold for 5D, where you’d be if you overcall 3D.
Yes, 3D is hardly risk-free. But passing is cowardly, and doubling fundamentally misguided, imo. It’s not as if you have any clear action if partner reopens with 2S. 3D is certainly, then, constructive but partner should never play you for 7 controls! KQ10xx xx Qxx Kxx is a decent game yet he can’t bid over 3D.
KQxxx x xx KQxxx even worse. Now you play 3D, with 6C pretty good. Note that over a 3D overcall, he bids 3S, you bid 4C and you reach game (slam is too tough)
I could go on, but anyone can construct hands to ‘prove’ a point.
Suffice it to say that I’d bid 3D at any form of scoring, because, while it is dangerous to do so, passing seems to me to be a bit more dangerous. Doubling, without spades and with only a modest 5 card suit, is nuts, imo. It’s far worse than passing.
As for 2N, I’ve seen inexperienced players play this as showing the minors. I don’t think I’ve ever heard of, let alone seen, a good pair use it that way, over a weak two. If intended as natural, it’s ridiculous. Yes, we may belong in 3N, but (if so), it’s extremely likely that we need partner to declare. And we’ll usually get there after a 3D overcall.
Btw, I do think this is a good problem, and that I’d hate holding this hand at the table. I’d be nervous if I bid, and even more nervous if I passed.
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