[661_Pete]

This is a situation I hate being put into. Game all, LHO dealer. I hold a collection of rubbish:
♠Kx
♥xx
♦KQxx
♣Q10xxx

As it happens, 4♠ would have found our fit and made. I chose 5♣ and when it was passed round to RHO who doubled, I called an 'SOS' XX - something I'm very loath to do at any time. But LHO rescued the situation by bidding 5♥ which made (needless to say W had a lot of hearts!). Not the best result, but still better than leaving them in 4♥X with an overtrick.

[eagles123]

may i suggest that if 4S would have found your fit, partners X was probably wrong - if partner is suggesting you should have bid 4S its pure resulting nonsense. I think 5c is reasonable, but you could consider 4N to show a 2 suited hand. I also really disagree with your assumption the XX is "SOS" - I think it's just blood - and even if it is SOS for your partnership I'm not entirely sure why you'd want to do it on this hand.

ps your hand is far from a collection of rubbish - imagine partner has a normal double such as Axxx x AJxx AKxx then you have a good chance of slam!

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

pass.

I can live with any of your choices, except 4S, with other = 4NT searching for your best minor fit.
You are (semi) balanced, you have some values out side hearts, you should have a reasonable chance
of setting it, assuming partner has a common hand.

A 6th spade is not a common hand pattern for partner.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[661_Pete]

Thanks. I certainly wouldn't have called 4♠ but with hindsight, my partner should have, holding AQ10xx and a decent split.

[Tramticket]

Pass looks right at these colours. 4NT second choice.

[cherdano]

In nige1 scoring, I think this is:
4N = 10
Pass = 9
5C = 8
5D = 5
4S = 2

Sorry to be a bit harsh about 5C!

[rmnka447]

A 4 ♠ bid should never be an option with your hand.

I think 4 NT is right getting partner to choose between the minors. You have longer ♣ but they're not so good. So partner's input is important.

At the 4 level, it more about getting to a decent contract rather than being perfect. If 4 ♠ is making, partner has to have 5+ pretty good ♠, so why isn't partner bidding 4 ♠?

[steve2005]

rmnka447, on 2017-May-22, 09:01, said:

A 4 ♠ bid should never be an option with your hand.

If someone thinks you should bid 4♠ on this hand they are resulters and don't listen to anything they say about bidding.

[apollo1201]

You don't have a collection of rubbish at all. All your goodies are outside of H and are support for partner's honors, or are sitting after responder's aces.
Facing an average TOX, you have good chances of making 5m, and it scores probably more setting 4HX (opener is red so should not have a rubbish that goes -3).
4NT should convey this message. 5C is okay but not as good imo. The rest about 4S and XX being sos is just a bit of a nonsense as every1 pointed out.

[RedSpawn]

rmnka447, on 2017-May-22, 09:01, said:

A 4 ♠ bid should never be an option with your hand.

I think 4 NT is right getting partner to choose between the minors. You have longer ♣ but they're not so good. So partner's input is important.

At the 4 level, it more about getting to a decent contract rather than being perfect. If 4 ♠ is making, partner has to have 5+ pretty good ♠, so why isn't partner bidding 4 ♠?

Agreed.

Again, your partner pays the cost to be the boss. If your partner is saying 4♠ was the bid, then how are you going to suggest that bid with a doubleton in your hand? It is really important that you remind your partner that you are not clairvoyant. He has to take some initiative when overcalling preemptive bids.

Your partner should be bidding 4♠ if his spade holding is that couture. No where in the auction did he mention that spade suit, so I would keep the post mortem focused on the bid he didn't make.

[SteveMoe]

Pass. Balanced values opposite a (strong) takeout will generally benefit from passing. Make the hand Kxx x KQxx Q10xxx and 4N is more appealing. I won't bid at the 5 level unless 1) I am sure we belong one level higher or 2) my ODR is skewed to bidding. Neither here.

[wank]

it's amusing that you think a 54 10 count with no points in the opps' suit opposite a 4 level take out double is a 'collection of rubbish'. obviously if you're going to bid, which is debatable, you should bid 4nt to show 2 places to play. as for your redouble that was beginner level.

[ahydra]

5m rates to be a make, but that doubleton heart does look a bit scary. I think I'd bid 4NT though as the chance of us getting 800 is poor, while there is some chance of a slam our way.

wank, on 2017-May-22, 20:16, said:

as for your redouble that was beginner level.

Be fair - I think the original X holding what sounds like a 4S bid (or even a pass given the comment about 4HX+1?), and then trying to tell OP he should bid 4S on a doubleton opposite the X, is surely worse!

ahydra

[wank]

ahydra, on 2017-May-22, 22:10, said:

and then trying to tell OP he should bid 4S on a doubleton opposite the X, is surely worse!

ahydra

nowhere does it say that his partner said that. all it says is that 4s would have worked out better. as for partner's double, with the right shape i think 5 spades is ok. if 5h makes though it sounds like partner is a little lacking in high cards.

[ahydra]

Ah, sorry, I managed to misread the OP's followup - thought partner had 6 spades, and then followed a bunch of comments where people were talking (but only hypothetically) about someone said OP should respond 4S which threw me.

Agree one would X rather than 4S with eg 51(43) scattered values, 5044.

ahydra

[nekthen]

I would love to see a hand where partner has a sensible double, 4S makes and 5H makes

[GrahamJson]

My vote, which I made too quickly, went to Pass, although I now think that 4NT is probably better. It's certainly close.

If i kibbed anyone on BBO bidding 4S on this hand, and making, I would suspect they were the owners of two computers.

[msjennifer]

I shall bid 4NT .If 4 S and 5H are both making but 5 of a minor chosen by my partner is going down then I shall be looking for another partner.

[miamijd]

As others have noted, 4NT (two-suited, NOT minors) is the best call here.

I'm surprised so many are advocating (or even seriously considering) passing. The secondary values in the minors are great for offense, but not so good for defense. With the opponents likely having a 10-fit (sure, partner could have 2-3 hearts, but he rates to have a stiff), opener could easily be 1741 and responder 5314, in which case the opponents will probably make 5H.

Cheers,
Mike

[nige1]

661_Pete, on 2017-May-22, 04:36, said:

This is a situation I hate being put into. Game all, LHO dealer. I hold a collection of rubbish: ♠ K x ♥ x x ♦ K Q x x ♣ Q 10 x x x
As it happens, 4♠ would have found our fit and made. I chose 5♣ and when it was passed round to RHO who doubled, I called an 'SOS' XX - something I'm very loath to do at any time. But LHO rescued the situation by bidding 5♥ which made (needless to say W had a lot of hearts!). Not the best result, but still better than leaving them in 4♥X with an overtrick.

miamijd, on 2017-May-23, 10:37, said:

As others have noted, 4NT (two-suited, NOT minors) is the best call here. I'm surprised so many are advocating (or even seriously considering) passing. The secondary values in the minors are great for offense, but not so good for defense. With the opponents likely having a 10-fit (sure, partner could have 2-3 hearts, but he rates to have a stiff), opener could easily be 1741 and responder 5314, in which case the opponents will probably make 5H.

Please post the full deal, 661_Pete.