[awm]

Playing Meckwell Light with South as dealer and opponents passing, how should the auction go?

---

We are stuck with the methods, although feel free to comment if you think south should open something else.

The auction at the table was not a success:

1♣! - 1♥!
2♦ - 3♦
3♠ - 4♣
4♦ - 5♦
Pass

The 3♠ call was intended as a suit but taken as a cuebid, and we were unable to find the superior spade game. The contract actually made when West underlead the club queen and it was ducked to the jack, but at MP scoring we were still losing to everyone in the normal 4♠.

[wank]

off the top of my head:-

1C-1H-2S canape with diamonds
1C-1H-2D-2H waiting
1C-1H-2D-2H-2S hearts

doesn't cause too much trouble on finding your major fit whilst saving space over 2D

perhaps you're using 2S already for some other awkward shapes though

[awm]

wank, on 2017-May-12, 11:25, said:

off the top of my head:-

1C-1H-2S canape with diamonds
1C-1H-2D-2H waiting
1C-1H-2D-2H-2S hearts

doesn't cause too much trouble on finding your major fit whilst saving space over 2D

perhaps you're using 2S already for some other awkward shapes though

Obviously this is far from a problem if you have finely tuned agreements. I was more interested in how people would bid in the somewhat "standard" Meckwell Lite precision. Does this include such waiting bids? I wasn't aware of such.

[wank]

awm, on 2017-May-12, 12:25, said:

Obviously this is far from a problem if you have finely tuned agreements. I was more interested in how people would bid in the somewhat "standard" Meckwell Lite precision. Does this include such waiting bids? I wasn't aware of such.

ok the simple answer is north was just wrong. the 3 level is for shape, not cuebids. yes, south might not have 4, but if so, he'll probably be probing for 3NT with weak hearts in which case when north shows spade support south can correct.

[fred]

After:

1C 1H
2D

We play the following (I have left out the details of what happens next):

2H=Waiting
2S=5+ hearts
2NT=Diamond raise with at least one 4-card major
3C=6+ clubs
3D=Balanced raise with no 4-card major
3H/3S/3NT=Splinters for D in C/H/S

So we would bid 2NT with the hand in question, find our 4-4 spade fit via a 3C inquiry, and play in 4S (which is not to suggest that I think 4S is necessarily the best contract with these cards).

I am not sure if there is a "Standard Meckwell Lite" in this area. Geoff Hampson told me about the 2NT bid several years ago and he is probably as in tune as anyone is in terms of what most of the expert-level Meckwell Lite players in the USA are doing.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[spotlight7]

Open 1D. Precision auctions starting with 1C*(when opener

holds diamonds) are a problem area for Precision pairs.

1D-1S-3S-4S


If you do open 1C*, Meckwell bids by step replies after a positive:

1) no fit, min. 2) no fit, max. 3) fit, min. 4) fit, max.


You would find the D fit and opener can next find the spade fit.

[sfi]

awm, on 2017-May-12, 10:52, said:

Playing Meckwell Light with South as dealer and opponents passing, how should the auction go?

[hand removed]

We are stuck with the methods, although feel free to comment if you think south should open something else.

I don't know enough about the details of the system, but this looks like a hand that would be better to downgrade and start with 1D. When I've played strong club systems, that was always worth considering, and here it looks like there is a real problem opening 1C with minimum 4M-5 diamond hands.

[PrecisionL]

Yes. downgrade and open 1♦ (only 4 controls) or open 1♠ to shut out the hearts.

[DinDIP]

If the 1♥ response denies 5+S (because a 1♠ response shows any positive with 5+spades) then responder could rebid 2♠ and only show a four-card suit. But Fred's structure is better as it allows responder to show both support and a four-card major.

[fred]

In "Standard Meckwell Lite"...

1C 1H
2S

is used for all 4441 hands. In my regular Precision partnerships we also include hands with 5H(440). Opener's suit rebids are always 5+ cards.

So, once you decide to open 1C with this hand, rebidding 2D is the only viable option in "Standard Meckwell Lite".

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[rhm]

Frankly I admit I do not know Meckwell light, but I do not understand the issue. I do know major suit fits can not be ignored at this game.

As far as I understand Meckwell light 1♣-1♥ denies a 5 card spade suit.
Then assuming 1♣-1♥-2♦ does not deny a four card spade suit by opener, there should be a way for responder to show a four card spade suit.
If 1♣-1♥-2♦-3♦ does not deny a four card spade suit by responder, then opener must have a way of showing one.

This is not a problem auction this is a matter of having agreements. As usual having any agreement is better than having no agreements. Make up your mind.
At times bridge is a simple game.

However, I suspect something else was going on:

Responders dianond raise more or less denied a 4 card spade suit, and responder choose to ignore his spade suit, because responder had to consider what might happen if you did have a 4-4 fit in spades, in which case spades might make a terrible strain for slam purposes.
Well I have some sympathy with this view, but in this case there was no way finding this spade fit.
If the ranges of your openings get wider and your minimum requirements for 1♣ lower, you run into this type of costs.

Rainer Herrmann

[DJNeill]

Hi all,
I have always understood 1C-1H-1N to allow for a 5431 without a 5M, so I would have gone with that to begin with, and have the understanding that opener can refuse to play in responder's 6crd major with 3NT (and it not be serious).

Thanks,
Dan

awm, on 2017-May-12, 10:52, said:

Playing Meckwell Light with South as dealer and opponents passing, how should the auction go?

---

We are stuck with the methods, although feel free to comment if you think south should open something else.

The auction at the table was not a success:

1♣! - 1♥!
2♦ - 3♦
3♠ - 4♣
4♦ - 5♦
Pass

The 3♠ call was intended as a suit but taken as a cuebid, and we were unable to find the superior spade game. The contract actually made when West underlead the club queen and it was ducked to the jack, but at MP scoring we were still losing to everyone in the normal 4♠.

[foobar]

DJNeill, on 2017-May-15, 13:05, said:

Hi all,
I have always understood 1C-1H-1N to allow for a 5431 without a 5M, so I would have gone with that to begin with, and have the understanding that opener can refuse to play in responder's 6crd major with 3NT (and it not be serious).

Thanks,
Dan

+1. Adam, if I am not mistaken IMPrecision also allows 1N to handle such awkward hands, especially after a 1♣ - 1♠ response, right (since 2♣ would be a GF)?

[awm]

The IMPrecision auction is a very different situation because: 1. We cannot have a major suit fit, whereas in the original auction we can easily have one. 2. We are often looking for a playable partial, whereas the original auction is game forcing.

It seems like the solution here is to have more methods for the auction (along the lines of what Fred does) or to distort openers hand in some way (either by opening 1 diamond or rebidding one no trump).

I'm personally not a big fan of preemptively distorting my hand due to one or more awkward sequences (my theory is that you never really know how the auction will go) but I know some people bid this way. More methods are usually fine by me, but my mentees adopted this system because it's supposed to be a "simple version of strong club" so I don't know what to think about that. Anyway I will communicate the advice!

[benlessard]

From a bidding space theory it make sense that in GF auction you want to bid the cheapest bid quite often.

im 100% convinced that over 1H its really inneficient to play that 1S always shows 5+S.