[Vampyr]

Matchpoints.

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What is the final double?

[monikrazy]

Looks like a clear penalty double.

[aguahombre]

A true torturer would expect me to guess she has AX KJXX JXXX AXX. No fifth heart because of first pass, no 4 spades because she didn't cue 2C, and opening strength on subtract-a-King advances to balancing doubles. Oh, wait...Terry is a true torturer.

BTW, how do we know it will be the final double?

[Vampyr]

aguahombre, on 2014-February-12, 20:48, said:

A true torturer would expect me to guess she has AX KJXX JXXX AXX. No fifth heart because of first pass, no 4 spades because she didn't cue 2C, and opening strength on subtract-a-King advances to balancing doubles. Oh, wait...Terry is a true torturer.

BTW, how do we know it will be the final double?

We don't, but this is the double under consideration.

[Vampyr]

Please delete duplicate

[kenberg]

I think that it means West expected, on the auction, to make 2♥ and thinks that there is some reasonable shot at beating 3♣, mostly on power.I imagine West has some club cards but I would not expect a stack. East did double earlier, a balance but still a double, and presumably he has some sort of clubs (oops, bad eyesight, I thought the opening bid was a spade. But still I think the general idea is right.) , but if he, East, is light in this department and has four hearts, I think he could consider pulling it.

So: Decent values, a club trick or two, probably a decent hand to lead from . He expects it to be left in but is prepared to have it pulled if East thinks it should be.

I'm guessing this is matchpoints, not imps. At imps it sounds like a call that I just wouldn't make.

[paulg]

My rule is that once we have passed out our contract, future doubles are penalty. There are one or two auctions where you'd prefer to have a double as competitive, but the simplicity of the rule overrides these.

[Zelandakh]

Penalty. When partner passed 2♥ that became our "fit". So subsequent doubles are penalty. I think this is pretty standard even if playing (almost) all low level doubles takeout.

[mcphee]

Aguanombre gave a rather respectable hand that would double 3C, maybe that A of S could be a K. The opening bidder has the best hand and happens to have 4S from the sound of the bidding. Unless the guy is a complete beginner they should be prepared to hear responder bid 3C. The dble for me is not pure penalty but shows a hand that wants to compete, possible 2-4-4-3 most likely shape.

[P_Marlowe]

Penalty / Optional.

If partner wants to play 3H, he can say it.
I will only bid 3H, if I have 5 1/2 hearts.

In the end I showed some life, but partner did know, that I am a passed
hand, hence he can judge if game is an option, he said no.
Nevertheless, we still may have at least half of the pot and going for
200 is always good playing MP.

And if you think X is a torture bid, you have not played with me, or
with my partner, if it comes to torture bids, the given X is kindergarten.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[ArtK78]

This seems to be a normal matchpoint double. Based on the preceding auction, the 2♥ bidder believes that it is our hand. We chose to play in 2♥, to get +110 or more. They came back in vul, and now we cannot afford to pass this out as +100 will not compensate us for our +110 or more. So we try for +200.

Partner can bid 3♥ if his hand is not suitable for defense, but most often we will play in 3♣x. After all, the opps passed the hand out in 1♣. There is certainly a reasonable chance that they cannot make 9 tricks in clubs.

[aguahombre]

ArtK78, on 2014-February-13, 09:14, said:

This seems to be a normal matchpoint double. Based on the preceding auction, the 2♥ bidder believes that it is our hand. We chose to play in 2♥, to get +110 or more. They came back in vul, and now we cannot afford to pass this out as +100 will not compensate us for our +110 or more. So we try for +200.

Partner can bid 3♥ if his hand is not suitable for defense, but most often we will play in 3♣x. After all, the opps passed the hand out in 1♣. There is certainly a reasonable chance that they cannot make 9 tricks in clubs.

This sums it up just right, IMO...especially the part I highlighted. My usual disagreement with labelling the double as "penalty". It is what it is. I would add, however, that Partner could also bid 3D with (say) 3-5 in the reds and a collection not suitable for defense.

[mycroft]

"There are two kinds of penalty doubles...Solo Flights and Suggestions to Partner." - paraphrased from memory, S.J. Simon, Why You Lose at Bridge.

Lots of Simon's penalty doubles (of both types) have gone the way of the dodo - but the Matchpoint Double is almost a classic example of "Suggestion to Partner"; and if that means it would be called a penalty double in 1947, I don't feel I am wrong calling it a penalty double now.

The EBU has more terms in their formal continuum you can hang a "optional, leaning to..." description on, I realize.