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An accident in JEC match (poll)

Poll: An accident in JEC match (poll) (17 member(s) have cast votes)

Cue in the xfer suit means what to you ?

  1. T/O double and strong at these colors. (5 votes [29.41%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 29.41%

  2. Bicolor hand (spade+minor or specified minor) strong at these colors. (12 votes [70.59%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 70.59%

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#1 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 15:35

Me and my pd had an accident in JEC match. I could have bid differently but what i actually seek is, what ohers play this cue as ?


1NT=14-16
2♦=xfer to ♥

My pd had 4243 17 hcp, but i thought he had 5♠+5 minor and a good hand at these colors, thought he cld pass and DBL 2 or 3 ♥ with this.

What is it in your pdship ? What would you expect if u are playing with a pick up pd ?

Thanks in advance for your replies :)
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#2 User is offline   655321 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 15:39

I like to play double of the transfer as takeout of hearts, and the cue as Michaels.

If you play that the double of the transfer shows diamonds, there seems to be some case for the cue to be takeout, not my preference though.
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#3 User is offline   JLOGIC 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 15:49

we have had this thread before, it may have been even before 655321s time, cue gwnn!

Cliffs:

edit, my cliffs may be wrong so ill edit! But I THINK it was:

Cue=michaels, X=lead direct, pass with a takeout X of hearts, cry if they super accept. Why? Cuz fred said so :P
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#4 User is offline   mfa1010 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 15:55

I play what fred said.

Against weak NT: X=strong. 14-16 is not weak though.
Michael Askgaard
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#5 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 16:05

View PostJLOGIC, on 2010-December-29, 15:49, said:

we have had this thread before, it may have been even before 655321s time, cue gwnn!

Cliffs:

edit, my cliffs may be wrong so ill edit! But I THINK it was:

Cue=michaels, X=lead direct, pass with a takeout X of hearts, cry if they super accept. Why? Cuz fred said so :P


Oh well, i didnt know it was asked b4. Just asking seemed much easier than digging the whole forum to find out if it was posted b4.

By the way, if u don't mind, what would be your average hand examples for 5-5 at these colors ?
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
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#6 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 16:05

View PostJLOGIC, on 2010-December-29, 15:49, said:

we have had this thread before, it may have been even before 655321s time, cue gwnn!

Cliffs:

edit, my cliffs may be wrong so ill edit! But I THINK it was:

Cue=michaels, X=lead direct, pass with a takeout X of hearts, cry if they super accept. Why? Cuz fred said so :P


This, although it seems you can make a reasonable argument that 2♥ over 2♦ is takeout, and 2♠ over 2♥ is Michaels.

@Timo - this doesn't seem like a hand that turns into a total disaster. Did you play a 3-3 club fit or something when you tried 3♣ pass/correct?
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#7 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 16:06

We play, after (1N) _P (2♦ = hearts) ??
  • _X = Diamonds (With spades as well, you may get an opportunity to bid them later).
  • 2♥ = T/O of hearts (as your partner assumed).
  • Other suits = Natural.
  • 2N = Minors
Similarly, after (1N) _P (2♥ = spades) ??
  • _X = Hearts (with a two-suiter, you may get an opportunity to bid your other suit later).
  • 2♠ = T/O of spades.
  • Other suits = Natural.
  • 2N = Minors.
But Fed/JLOGICs suggestion that the cue-bid = Michaels seems to be an improvement.
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#8 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 16:50

View PostPhil, on 2010-December-29, 16:05, said:


@Timo - this doesn't seem like a hand that turns into a total disaster. Did you play a 3-3 club fit or something when you tried 3♣ pass/correct?


No, it wasnt a disaster, nt opener doubled 2♥, i bid 4♠ with Jxxxx xxx xx KTx went down vs his AQxx Kx AKx J9xx. I also thought, in this type of hands, if cue = 5-5 we must find a way to put 1NT opener on lead. If he leads ♥, we could have made it even vs 4234. Or if ♥ A was on or ♠ K on. I know my 4♠ is very agressive, i thought we had a very good shot if he had 5-5 hands that can bid at these colors.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
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#9 User is offline   nigel_k 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 17:18

Agree with the delayed takeout double idea, but I don't know what I would expect undiscussed. I think it would be close to 50/50 whether a random expert would have takeout or Michaels when they do this.

I have also wondered about the wrong-siding issue when using Michaels or even a takeout double in fourth seat. But I don't think there is a solution that I would be willing to rely on myself or my partner to remember.
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#10 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 17:24

View PostJLOGIC, on 2010-December-29, 15:49, said:

pass with a takeout X of hearts, cry if they super accept.

The corollory is that if you like making your opponents cry you should superaccept often.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#11 User is offline   JLOGIC 

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Posted 2010-December-29, 17:28

View Postgnasher, on 2010-December-29, 17:24, said:

The corollory is that if you like making your opponents cry you should superaccept often.


Heh if you like winning the maximum amount of imps/MP this is not necessarily true though since they usually don't have a t/o X.
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