[mike777]

fwiw as a nonexpert I would assume opener has a minimum. If opener has lots of extras she will bid over my sign off.

Of course if opener has an inbetween hand say 14-16 or so....tough.

--


2/1 gf shows a good hand for me.

In any event I still bid 4c planning on rebidding 4nt(void s) over 4d or 4h. Will cue 5d over 5c if the bidding goes that way.

[mgoetze]

gnasher, on 2010-December-21, 18:24, said:

And I find it useful to mention such weaknesses in forums like this, in case somebody has something helpful to suggest.

What generally happens is that Frances tells us she has pages and pages of notes covering artificial continuations, and I keep wishing she would actually tell us the contents of said pages.

[rduran1216]

on the actual hand, I started with 4C, and over 4H bid 5NT as GSF

Absent discussion, I assumed 3H showed extras, and my partner, who is a solid expert, had a balanced 12 count with AQx of hearts...it did not make.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

4C, after 4H from p, I will bid 4S, that should show shortage,
The way we play it, 4C already denied a spade top honor, I wont
stop below 6H.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[ewleongusa]

rduran1216, on 2010-December-21, 01:10, said:

---

Whats the plan?

Spoiler: if you bid 4C, partner bids 4H, what now?

I plan to bid 4D followed by 5C followed by 6H. Since I never bid RKC, partner should work out I have a spade void and I am asking him to bid a grand with some good in both hearts and diamonds.

Eric Leong

[phil_20686]

Seems like a lot of people dont play any good system here, and its a big loser imo. I picked up some system of a polish player that works pretty well here:

after 1!s-2!h

3H= 3 hearts, minor shortage, extras, then 3s agrees hearts and asks for shortage, 3N agrees spades and asks for shortage.
3N= 5-4-(1-3) 11-14, 4c asks for singleton
4m= 5-4-(13), 15+
4h= 11-14 5-4-2-2

all other minimum hands bid 2s, and over the (virtually obligatory) 2N asking,
3h = 3 hearts,
4m = 5-3-1-4, 11-14.


Some relevant continuations:

1S - 2H 3H - 3S -?
>>>> 3NT = shortage C, no cue in D
>>>> 4C = shortage clubs, cue-bid in D
>>>> 4D = shortage diamonds, cue-bid in C
>>>> 4H = shortage D, no cue-bid in C


1S - 2H 3H 3NT -?
>>>> 4C = shortage clubs, cue in D
>>>> 4D = shortage diamonds, cue-bid in C
>>>> 4H = shortage C, no cue-bid in D
>>>> 4S = shortage D, no cue-bid in C
>>>>

So since my partners have shown extras and 5-3-1-4 (or 6-3-1-3 with poor spades), then I will bid 3S to agree hearts and ask for the minor shortage, then I should be able to get enough info to bid the grand or not with confidence. He will probably show diamond shortage with a club control. You should be well placed after this. If partner shows a club shortage you will certainly blast exclusion in spades. It might be close opposite a diamond shortage. Probably settle for some cue bids and give partner the option to bid GS or not.

[whereagles]

I'll try and find the key cards, but I think this is very likely to fail and we end up in 6♥...

[awm]

As someone who plays 2/1 not necessarily forcing to game, we have:

3♥ shows extras and almost always four-card support
4♥ is fairly minimum and normally 5422
4m is a splinter, usually fairly minimum and always 4-card heart support

With extras and three-card support, we can start by bidding a four-card minor or bidding 2NT (which is a balanced GF) and then bidding hearts later. With a minimum and three-card support (or a really horrible hand that doesn't want to be in game despite 4-card support) we can start with 2♠ (catch-all, forcing one round) and then correct to hearts later.

Obviously this SAYC-based style (where 2♠ is waiting and anything else is GF) is very different from Acol (which has a lot more non-forcing bids). But in any case, we don't have huge issues with limiting opener's strength.