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Bid this one

#21 User is offline   kenrexford 

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Posted 2008-February-19, 17:20

awm, on Feb 19 2008, 04:23 PM, said:

To Ken Rexford, I agree that 3NT by south is an excellent contract. Unfortunately your (and most other) auction reaches 3NT by north.

Oh yeah -- missed that.

I'd still decide to play 3NT, though. From Opener's standpoint, Qxx works well. From Responder's standpoint, he has no reason to fear the diamonds, as Axx from Opener works well.

If the auction were standard, I would still respond 1NT. A 2 does not promise any hand with 10 points. It promises 10+, but some 10-counts respond 1NT. I think that this is one of those hands. If 1NT was still forcing (like old K-S), then the auction would be identical. If 1NT was non-forcing, then Opener is pinched and has a problem. This is actually a good argument for a forcing 1NT, strangely. A forcing 1NT is traditionally argued as a means of helping a wildly unbalanced Responder. However, a forcing 1NT also strangely helps a "wildly balanced" Opener who has extra stuff but not enough for a JS or reverse.

If the auction were such as to allow a 2 response with this hand, I'd still end up in 3NT, I think. Opener would hear 2 and bid 2. This is GF. It seems that Responder should now blast 3NT with the actual hand, passed out. This seems like a fast arrival hand.

However, let's assume no fast arrival and a 2NT rebid. I don't understand why Opener would imply 4513 pattern when his clubs are Qx and he has the diamond Ace. I think the chessehead auction should be ...2NT-P-3NT.

So, how about the insane reverse auction? Opener decides, after a (forcing?) 1NT, to reverse into 2, showing a much better hand than he has. Responder bids 3 to suggest clubs (imagine that -- natural) and imply diamond concern (very weak inference). Opener now bid 3 as a "punt bid." Why would Responder show 10x heart support when he had J10x in diamonds? That looks like help to me. I think even in this auction 3NT is the call.

If there is any real question on this hand, it is whether there is a plausible way to bid where Responder's usual first call is not one that grabs notrump declarership too frequently. The only decent ideas I can think of are that inversion business (don't know how this hand would be bid) and some weird thing called a "Toddler 2" response (http://www.firesides.net/toddler.htm). I actually played a modified Toddler 2 in another guy's homespun canape system, but I cannot remember how effective it was. But, the idea is to have a technique that minimizes the use of a forcing 1NT response.
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#22 User is offline   Yogeshdg 

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Posted 2008-February-20, 23:11

Sorry whether i respond 2 or a forcing 1nt me and my pd will always reach 3nt.

Well done if you reach 4 AND make it
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#23 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 01:31

kenrexford, on Feb 20 2008, 02:23 AM, said:

1-P-1NT(forcing)-P-
2-P-2("impossible" club raise)-P-
3NT-all pass

Same sequence as Ken playing 2/1. Playing big C I used to play at times, you could get to 3NT from the other side via 1C 2D* 2NT
Where 2D shows a flat positive.
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#24 User is offline   inquiry 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 01:47

Scoring: MP

Auction 1.

1NT - 3NT

(3NT by south), all it takes is off shape 1NT


Scoring: MP

Auction 1.

1NT - 3NT

(3NT by south), all it takes is off shape 1NT



Scoring: MP

Auction 1.

1NT - 3NT

(3NT by south), all it takes is off shape 1NT


Scoring: MP

Auction 1.

1NT - 3NT

(3NT by south), all it takes is off shape 1NT


Scoring: MP

Auction 1.

1NT - 3NT

(3NT by south), all it takes is off shape 1NT

--Ben--

#25 User is offline   cjames 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 02:51

1-1NT (SF)
2-2 (16+ or min with 4+ ; GF opp 16+)
2NT -3 (16+ with 4card side suit ; asking)
3 - 4/

Now responder can bid one of the major games, knowing it is probably better then 3NT.
Squeeze me
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#26 User is offline   rbforster 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 06:01

I'm surprised at how the few strong club auctions haven't managed to have South declare. In several transfer-oriented strong club systems we would have bid:

1*-1* 16+; GF bal
1N®-... relays where responder shows 3235 and min GF values
3N

Otherwise put me down in the 1-1N-2 camp that plays 3N from North.
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#27 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 09:13

I would probably bid

1-1NT
2-3NT

but on another partnership it could go:

1-1* (1NT is spades)
2-3
3NT


reaching a much better contract played from the south side.
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#28 User is offline   cjames 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 12:16

IceRelay:

1-1 (16+ ; 8+ no singelton or void, no 5card major)
1-2 (Relay; 3 2)
2-3 (Relay, 3-2-3-5)
3-3 (Relay, 3 controls)
3NT
Squeeze me
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#29 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2008-February-21, 15:35

Look that is the system I'm going to play, rightsides the contract and doesn't disclose declarer's hand :)
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
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#30 User is offline   mr1303 

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Posted 2008-February-22, 12:45

Dare I say it: 18th Century Acol:

1H 2C
2NT(15-16 balanced) 3NT

or 1H 2C
2S 3D
3NT

I think South has too much for a not forcing 2H after 2C by North.
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