Revised robot play
#1
Posted 2012-February-23, 22:58
#2
Posted 2012-February-24, 08:42
#3
Posted 2012-February-24, 20:49
Bbradley62, on 2012-February-24, 08:42, said:
I'm venting, to be sure, but it's not a temporal thing. Since August the change has been most perceptible, IMO, and lately it seems worse than ever. It's difficult to quantify, but I believe there is merit to what I am saying and I was just wondering if anyone else was having the same or a similar impression.
#4
Posted 2012-February-26, 19:31
http://www.bridgebas...on-20-released/
#6
Posted 2012-February-27, 06:33
barmar, on 2012-February-26, 19:31, said:
http://www.bridgebas...on-20-released/
I'm not at all sure how this helps answer the question, but if you're going to give this you might as well also give:
V19, 10/18/2011: http://www.bridgebas...on-19-released/
V18, 9/5/2011: http://www.bridgebas...on-18-released/
V17, 6/7/2011: http://www.bridgebas...9-gib-upgraded/
#7
Posted 2012-February-27, 16:53
#8
Posted 2012-February-29, 11:44
#10
Posted 2012-March-02, 23:45
Bbradley62, on 2012-February-27, 06:33, said:
V19, 10/18/2011: http://www.bridgebas...on-19-released/
V18, 9/5/2011: http://www.bridgebas...on-18-released/
V17, 6/7/2011: http://www.bridgebas...9-gib-upgraded/
So do these changes support what I am saying? Remember, I said it goes back to August when my results became perceptibly different even though I was then playing in the same manner I always had played when I was much more succesful.
#11
Posted 2012-March-03, 19:19
edward5958, on 2012-March-02, 23:45, said:
Your original message didn't mention the time frame, so I assumed you were talking about a change noticed in the past few weeks. As I said, we haven't made any changes to the play. Changes to the bidding rules will affect its inferences about the unseen suits, that's it.
If you can't be specific about the manner of the change you perceive, it's hard for us to give a more useful answer. If your results have gotten worse, it could be because the robot opponents are playing better, or because your robot partner is playing worse.
#12
Posted 2012-March-05, 16:42
that I have taken a one week+ break from them.
However, I think the poor results are due to an extended lapse in concentration on my part,
although I am not conscious of being distracted.
I have not noticed any more than usual questionable Robot decisions, and to be fair about
it almost all such that I post here turn out to have some reasonable explanation.
FWIW I have kept a spreadsheet record:
For 249 tournaments ending 2/15/12 I scored 51.48% in MP competition and +156.37 in IMP.
For 20 MP tournaments 2/16 through 2/26 the humiliating MP average was 45.77% with 16/20 below 50% and 17/20 below average in player score ranking. During the same stretch I played in 5 IMP tournaments with 3/5 negative results and 4/5 below average player rank.
PS-- now that I think about it I have noticed a few more than usual deals where GiB bids with 3hcp less than bidding box explanation (I wish it could be limited to a max 2hcp "lie"). That is not an excuse for the extent of my recent poor showing, though.
#14
Posted 2012-March-05, 20:00
barmar, on 2012-March-03, 19:19, said:
If you can't be specific about the manner of the change you perceive, it's hard for us to give a more useful answer. If your results have gotten worse, it could be because the robot opponents are playing better, or because your robot partner is playing worse.
OP specified his six-month timeframe in post #3, two days before you made your first reply in which you "assumed [he was] talking about a change noticed in the past few weeks".
Also, it appears to me that OP is using the phrase "style of play" to mean "the way GIB plays the game of bridge", not necessarily specifying play of the hand as opposed to bidding.
#15
Posted 2012-March-06, 10:08
Anyway, the updates are SUPPOSED to change the way it plays. Ideally for the better, but if you've gotten used to the old bugs then you may have to relearn (and get used to new bugs).
#16
Posted 2012-March-06, 20:40
Bbradley62, on 2012-March-05, 19:52, said:
So, does that mean than noone shares it? Is it possible that some who do share it don't read this board, or that some just don't want to comment? All I really know for sure is that you disagree and that's your prerogative but it doesn't invalidate my impression.
#17
Posted 2012-March-06, 20:47
barmar, on 2012-March-03, 19:19, said:
If you can't be specific about the manner of the change you perceive, it's hard for us to give a more useful answer. If your results have gotten worse, it could be because the robot opponents are playing better, or because your robot partner is playing worse.
Is this possible? Do the robots predictably play that differently at different tables? If so, it could very well explain what I have been experiencing lately compared to what it was like before last August. Whatever it is, it just seems that I am consistently in the wrong contract now, or that my p and I don't defend properly etc. on a regular basis. All one has to do it look at my mp totals since August compared to before to see the results of what I am saying. And I am (was) playing the same number of tournaments.
#18
Posted 2012-March-06, 20:56
barmar, on 2012-March-06, 10:08, said:
Anyway, the updates are SUPPOSED to change the way it plays. Ideally for the better, but if you've gotten used to the old bugs then you may have to relearn (and get used to new bugs).
I have always assumed that what I needed to do was just play Bridge and that the robots would do the same. Indeed, I know the bots have their idiosyncrasies, to say the least, but I never realized so much as I do now that it is not so much Bridge as it is figuring out robot machinations. In any event, I would never tolerate such inconsistencies and unpredictability in any live partner and I don't play to continue to waste time and money fooling around with these machines either.
#19
Posted 2012-March-06, 21:00
USViking, on 2012-March-05, 16:42, said:
that I have taken a one week+ break from them.
However, I think the poor results are due to an extended lapse in concentration on my part,
although I am not conscious of being distracted.
I have not noticed any more than usual questionable Robot decisions, and to be fair about
it almost all such that I post here turn out to have some reasonable explanation.
FWIW I have kept a spreadsheet record:
For 249 tournaments ending 2/15/12 I scored 51.48% in MP competition and +156.37 in IMP.
For 20 MP tournaments 2/16 through 2/26 the humiliating MP average was 45.77% with 16/20 below 50% and 17/20 below average in player score ranking. During the same stretch I played in 5 IMP tournaments with 3/5 negative results and 4/5 below average player rank.
PS-- now that I think about it I have noticed a few more than usual deals where GiB bids with 3hcp less than bidding box explanation (I wish it could be limited to a max 2hcp "lie"). That is not an excuse for the extent of my recent poor showing, though.
Thanks for your post. I hope your problems get straightened out soon. Of course, it could be that you are beginning to experience the same thing I am talking about here and I would appreciate your letting me know if that turns out to be the case.
#20
Posted 2012-March-07, 15:46
1. Old BBO version. If you use the old, downloaded BBO, it runs the GIB program locally on your PC. The speed of your CPU is a factor, because GIB limits the amount of time it thinks on a hand, so slower computers will do less thinking. You can also configure the thinking settings.
2. New BBO, basic robots. These are the robots you get when rent for $1/week. They don't do any simulations during the auction, and use a less sophisticated play algorithm.
3. New BBO, advanced robots. These are the robots you get when you rent for $1/day. They simulate during the auction (when the bidding rules allow) and use a more advanced play algorithm after the first few tricks.
Also, the simulations used during bidding and play make use of randomly dealt hands, and the random numbers will be different at each table.
Things are less variable in robot tournaments. These all use advanced robots running on the BBO servers, and the same random hands in simulations (as long as the human bidding and play are identical).